I really hope that I’m not the only one bothered by this incident.
http://www.kwwl.com/Global/story.asp?S=8737712
MADISON, Wis. (AP) – Wisconsin Democrats have told Debra Bartoshevich she can forget about being a delegate to the national convention next month.
Bartoshevich was elected by party activists as a pledged delegate for Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton. But after Clinton dropped out of the race, Bartoshevich told the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel she would support the Republican candidate, John McCain, over Barack Obama in the general election.
How dare a delegate not support the great one? I mean it’s not like the best candidate won or like it was in any way, shape or form a fairly won victory. It’s not like he’s some newbie with no idea how to run anything but his huge ego trips!
No, no and it’s certainly not that people feel he’s an elitist because of silly statements he made about “typical white people” or “bitter, religious zealots carrying their guns and racist attitudes”. No, I’m quite sure that has nothing to do with it. And the arugula thing well that’s nothing. It’s a non-issue. People don’t care that Obama whined about the “Brother you’re wearing me out! Can’t I just eat my waffle?” thing either. I mean after all we expect our leaders to lord it over us in America right?
Definitely there is no issue with the fact he went to church and listened to “God Damn America” from his mentor and spiritual guide the Rev. Jeremiah Wright for 20 years! I mean really! The man married Barrack and Michelle for crying out loud! He baptized their children! He brought Obama to Jesus and inspired the title of Obama’s best selling book The Audacity of Hope! How could anyone draw conclusions that he might share those views? Just because he tried to defend this crap as “normal” worship as if all pastors and churches normaly spend their efforts focusing on rage and hate! It’s an outrage! (sarcasm off for now)
It couldn’t be more clear as to why this brave woman stated she would not support Obama. There is certainly no shortage of reasons as you can see above. This is probably a conservative list compared to those of various voters who have problems with “coming to Obama”.
Naturally, those voters have been labled as racists. Thing is it has nothing at all to do with his race and everything to do with the fact that he is a spoiled, whiny, narcissistic, marxist who has decided that the world, not just America, the entire world should fall at his feet! He is running around the globe to bolster his lack of foriegn policy experience as if simply traveling and meeting dignataries will suffice for actual knowledge or experience. He has had to be reminded that he is not the president yet at least twice by, get this, reporters!
It is becoming increasingly more clear that the Obama and his minions will do anything and stop at nothing to silence any and all dissent. First they kick out any dissenters among the delegates then they establish a “free speech zone” for the upcoming Democratic convention to insure that all protesters will be safely out of the site and earshot of delegates and furthermore they will be detained in this area which is to be surrounded by chicken wire! As if anyone protesting the coronation of the Golden Idiot is a criminal and a danger to society.
Are we still in America? I thought our country was founded on freedom and that one of those freedoms we fought for was the right to free speech! Dissent is patriotic by it’s very nature! What’s next?
If you visit some pro-Obama blogs you’ll quickly find out that they intend to accept nothing less than their “saviour’s” status being officially changed to that of a God. There are lots of nasty people out there claiming they will procecute and punish all who “dare to attack Obama”! I’m not kidding at all. If you go the the Mitch & Nan Show blog ( I refuse to link to it go there at your own risk and be prepared to be completely disgusted if you do.) you will see tons of posts and comments stating exactly that. They say they are not a pro-Obama site yet they constantly refer to sending lists of email addresses and IP’s of people who visit larry Sinclair’s blog to David Axelrod and team Obama for “procecution after he is president” as if it is breaking the law to speak against him, vote against him or apparently even to visit the blog of someone who speaks against the great one.
They have said that Larry Sinclair will go to jail for his “crimes” which amount to daring to say he had a gay encounter with Obama during which they both used cocaine. Apparently they have decided that it is a lie whithout any research or hearing it from their messiah’s mouth and they have also decided that it’s a crime to even say such things whether or not they’re true.
Honestly I expect IF Obama can make it through November, unlikely as that is, he will have us all in brown shirts and combat boots screaming “Hail The Obama” like frenzied lap dogs by next year this time. Better practice your scream!
CQ
[...] News » News Hail The Obama…OR ELSE!2008-07-26 13:46:23byConvention being a pledged delegate to the national convention next month. [...]
Contrast that with the fact that in 1984, at Dallas, the GOP allowed Susan Catania to refuse to vote for the Gipper. Thus denying a possible unanimous vote. I did a post recently on her. Seems more and more the DNC is morphing out into something only vaguely a party, and narrowly democratic. What a shame!
Contrast this with the fact that in 1984, the GOP not only held a roll call, eventhough Reagan-Bush ran unapposed for re-nomination, they even allowed Susan Catania, a maverick, liberal from Chicago to spoil a unanimous vote. Catania, became a media darling at a boring show, and refused to vote for the Gipper!! it’s getting hard to say who the good guys are!
(ps: queen, delete this if I already commented on this topic, I had too many windows open, sigh)
sharmajee I left both posts as they both make good points! And I know what you mean about having too many windows open lol! Then I start opening tabs too it gets really hard to keep up with!
I think these people are really playing straight from the GOP handbook. They smear and then claim they were smeared, more blaming everyone else and then finally the indignant anger that anyone should subject the Great One to real questions or really anything other than making appearences. You know for all his fans.
If this were American Idol maybe but I think mainstream America is smarter than that! At least I hope they are!
CQ
I think a lot of people are confusing the nominating process within a party to that of a general election. When a party is nominating their candidate for president (be it Republican, Democrat, or any other party), they put their own rules and procedures in place. For instance, parties can decide that eligible voters be registered with the party.
Debra Bartoshevich the Democratic delegate is charged with voting for whom she believes to be the best Democratic Presidential Candidate. Does she really believe John McCain is the best choice for the Democratic Party? Nothing in that article led me to believe this is the case.
She’ll have to wait until November to vote for who she thinks would be the best President of the US.
Nicholas you were very civil so I’ll post your remarks for now but don’t get all Bot like on me!
Yes I agree the parties each have their own rules for the nomination process and they are admittedly different for primaries and general elections. Maybe she should not have spoken out loud in anger however I totally understand why she did. They did not need to take such a totaltarian approach to this. If they wanted true unity they could have tried to win her vote but no they decided to strip her of her status because she dared to speak against the Golden One.
Truthfully there is a rule in the Democratic Charter that states that any delegate who does not endorse the party’s choice for nominee within 30 DAY OF THE NOMINATION AT THE CONVENTION shall be stripped of their status. It clearly makes room for the passions and loyalties that are to be expected after such a close race. They don’t say if you don’t endorse immediately or if you speak against the candidate before the actual convention it reads within 30 days of the nomination at the convention. Go to the DNC website and look up the charter if you don’t believe me.
The fact is that even though there are different rules for primaries they are still supposed to be a fair, democratic process and they are supposed to reflect the will of “We the People”.
Debra was angry as are a lot of democrats who feel they have been circumvented for the party’s ego. They want to scream from every rooftop that they are the most progressive they nominated the first black man! Fact is they nominated the WRONG BLACK MAN! What good is it to nominate the first black man if he’s the worst possible chioce and will most certainly lose? They will set back the progress for that dream by their stupidity! There are many, many black politicians who are also true democrats not marxists, that are not anti-American, that actually have some leadership skills and experience to qualify them for the job! Why pick the Affirmative Action Candidate that could not win on his own but instead needed Super delegates and the DNC along with his great buddies in the media to drag him across the finish line?
Many feel, and for good reason, the DNC sold us out. They did not give a damn about the will of the people. They used thug tactics, sexisim and a host of Super Delegate ‘Endorsements” to push him over the top! He did not get enough PLEDGED DELEGATES to clinch the nomination, he did not win the popular vote and had the RBC not colluded with the Obama campaign in the Michigan/Florida debacle he certainly would have lost the popular vote by far mor and the in the differenc delegate count would not have been as large.
We are within our rights to expect our party to listen to us, to respect us and to count our votes they way they were cast not the way the DNC decided to re-apportion them! We are well within our rights to demand an open, honest and democratic convention. That means they need to quit telling us to get over it. They need to start treating us with respect. They need to quit trying to bury hillary and make it impossible for her delegates to cast this historic vote for the first ever viable woman candidate!
All we hear is about how Obama will make history yet no mention that Clinton also made history and she got more votes than ANY CANDIDATE IN A PRMARY EVER!
I’d say that gives us a reason to be angry and demanding wouldn’t you?
Thanks for allowing my post! It’s true I support Obama, albeit not rabidly. I did my homework before choosing who to support. And I won’t go BOT on you, scout’s honor.
You’re right, the democratic process is supposed to represent the will of “We the People”. But the “people” in this case isn’t the entire US. The “People” in this process are registered Democrats within the party. If Deborah is a McCain supporter, perhaps she doesn’t fit the definition of “people” in this case.
Don’t think its just the Democrats that are strict with rules either. Republicans in both Hawaii and Nevada shut down their entire conventions after the “people” wildly supported Ron Paul instead of McCain.
So do Clinton supporters have a reason to be upset? Of course, as anyone whose ever played a sport and lost a game would agree. Losing is never fun,
But do Clinton supporters have a reason to be irrational? No, and jumping from Clinton to McCain is just that. Except for some small differences, Clinton and Obama keep the same stance on almost all the issues. People like Deborah will help win the battle for Clinton, but lose the war for Democrats.
Well Nicholas I really appreciate your civil if different point of view as well as the fact that you have promised not to go “Bot” on me! I’m impressed that you haven’t called me a racist or a republican like a lot of “Bots” do.
See I really don’t have a problem with Obama supporters just the ones that are Bots. I can deal with a civil, well thought out response even if I don’t entirely agree.
I will admit that in the primaries “We the People” means only the people of the particular party. In this case the Democratic party. I will also disagree with you that all the Democrats had their votes and voices honored. The fact still remains that niether candidate received enough pledged delegates to clinch the nomination and the RBC decision and the entire MI/FL situationwas completely flawed no matter who you support. My hope is that it will bring about some real, meaningful election reform.
Honsetly if Clinton supporters felt that she had lost fair and square none of this would be happening. If we thought she was treated fairly and with respect none of this would have happened. If we thought MI and FL were treated fairly and with respect same deal. Truly the other, large factor is that most Obama supporters I have come across are not anywhere near as civil or lucid as you are.
Often these folks are angry and threatening and usually have little to say if you ask why they support Obama. You said you did your homework before deciding and I applaud you for it. Many however have obviously not even tried. They don’t try to argue with policies or evidence they just call us racists and republicans. Sadly even if he were the perfect candidate I and many others will never vote for him for that reason alone not that this is the only one.
I also have to disagree with you when you say Clinton supporters are being irrational as we believe not only was she cheated out of the nomination but we don’t believe Senator Obama has our best interest at heart. I know you will disagree and that’s ok. I just think we should be able to be straight with each other about our feelings. As long as we can be civil and respectful that is. I wish more Obama supporters were like you and actually took the time to think through a response before posting or making threats. Civil disagreements are a much better way to go.
I personally think it is Obama not Clinton that is splitting the party. he is the one who is driving it in a new direction away from the direction we, it’s base, have always gone. I fear for the party and the country if he is elected and I believe most Clinton supporters feel the same. We want change but not change so radical that we no longer recognize ourselves.
Ok I need to stop now. You’ll probably tire of my viewpoint. Sorry but I do enjoy the conversation!
CQ
I too enjoy the conversation.
You made a point – a very important point – which I don’t think has gotten its due attention. The whole Michigan/Florida thing has caused a lot of anguish for a lot of people.
I don’t want to rehash old history, but I think its fair to say the whole debacle can’t be blamed strictly on one person or group. It seems the best way to make sure this circus doesn’t happen again is with election reform.
Anyway, thanks again for the good chat. Maybe you’ll see me on some of your future posts….good luck!
Yes we can ALL agree that the Florida and Michigan thing caused havoc and does not get the attention it deserves. I don’t think anybody’s really happy about it.
We can also agree election reform is much needed and long over due.
Thanks for stopping by and conversing! I hope I do see you around!
Oh and good luck to you too!
CQ